And another – this panelboard doesn’t allow any tandem breakers. However, this is not always the case. The list comes in the box with the breakers, but you CANNOT use them willy-nilly in place of QO breakers. How much do tandem breakers cost? So I can install a SQ D Homeline in a Siemens panel….? Because of this, they're often referred to as "cheaters.". When tandem circuit breakers are used in locations where they're not allowed, they could make an improper physical connection to the bus bar in the panelboard, which can create a fire hazard. The horizontal version is the newer design. The thing is, although many Square D QO tandems have the same part number, they don’t all interchange. Also, a special thanks to Retired ASHI Member Douglas Hansen. Is this really 'cheating'? While a two-pole circuit breaker gets connected to two different poles at a panelboard and has a common trip or a handle tie for simultaneous disconnecting of two poles, a tandem breaker does not. No, it's not. Siemens space saving, plug in circuit breakers are intended for use in Siemens EQ, Siemens Ultimate, ITE, and Gould load centers and meter combinations that are rated to accept type QT breakers. Information for this article was provided, in part, by Alan Manche of Schneider Electric, Stephen Ploszay of Siemens Industry, Inc. and Joseph Fello of Eaton Corporation. This is probably where the term "cheater" comes from. I just purchased a house with this breaker: Siemens, Loadcenter, G2020B1100. I was curious about the events that led up to the discovery, and it all came down to one person being very curious and very persistent. The top-selling tandem breakers product is the Siemens 20 Amp Tandem Single Pole Type QT Circuit Breaker. First, a quick definition. Steele, Problems with James Hardie® Siding Installations, House GOP keeps Cheney as No. To ensure the warranty on a Siemens panel is not voided, the use of Siemens breakers is required. This is a cross reference of Type CL 1” breakers that could be interchangeable for panel installations. The wiring diagram inside the panelboard is a great way to determine if tandem breakers are allowed and, if so, exactly where they're allowed. They are normally installed in sit… It's all gross or creepy stuff we've seen over the past year as home inspectors. The 2008 version of the NEC removed the “lighting & appliance” panelboard designation, however, NEC 408.54 says “A panelboard shall be provided with physical means to prevent the installation of more overcurrent devices than that number for which the panelboard was designed, rated, and listed.”. When ordering a replacement or additional QO twin / tandem breaker for your panel, the best practice is to specify which of the four varieties is needed. Codes are set in place to protect people. At various points in time, Square D has labeled tandem circuit breakers with part numbers that did not hold true to this rule. I bought the homt type but the throat is too short, won't go all the way onto stab. Naturally, this blog is all about home inspections and home-related topics in the Twin Cities metro area. As clearly indicated by the label on the side of the circuit breaker pictured below, these circuit breakers are not allowed in ClassCTLpanelboards. We offer after hours sales & support for outages and electrical emergencies. Shop Siemens QP 15-Amp 2-Pole Tandem Circuit Breaker in the Circuit Breakers department at Lowe's.com. What's the big deal about reversed polarity? FLIR has a relatively new pocket-sized infrared camera with all of the bells and whistles of the much larger and expensive E6. Bus stabs without notches do not allow for tandem breakers installation but will allow for non-class CTL tandem breakers (QO) as replacements only. I pull out the top six breakers looking for the CTL tandem allowed spaces and they don't fit. Many electricians even call them “cheater” breakers for their ability to fit two into a location designed for just one. Hopefully this post have made you a bit more aware of tandem breakers and their potential hazards when installed improperly. Most tandem breakers range from $10 to $100 in price. In addition to working at Structure Tech, he is also a licensed Truth-In-Sale of Housing Evaluator in Minneapolis, Saint Paul and several other cities. In the photo below, you can see that the top four spaces allow only full size breakers, while the bottom eight slots allow tandem breakers. Always contact the manufacturer of your equipment to verify what devices are approved before installing. Although in many cases a part number is enough for these breakers, a little more information can help you avoid a lot of confusion. Non-Class CTL tandem circuit breakers do not have the ‘rejection’ feature that Class CTL breakers have. The breaker will turn off to interrupt current flow after a fault is detected. It's as if there's an unwritten rule that you have to be an old white guy to be a home inspector. These claim to be Siemens Q1515 QT breakers but won't fully seat in my panel. It appears that there is some sort of plastic pin that is holding the bus in place that is interfering with the breaker being fully inserted. When compared with a breaker from Home Depot these will never fit. When a home inspector finds tandem circuit breakers used in improper locations, they'll often recommend repair by an electrician. Panelboards must follow UL Standard 67, which requires all lighting and appliance panelboards to be Class CTL (Circuit Total Limiting). Also, using these modified tandem breakers may connect them to the bus bar in a manner that could potentially cause fire. If the wrong breaker is used it could fail to break (shut off power) during a surge. Q120 - Siemens 20A 1 Pole Breaker 20 Amp Single Pole 120V Circuit Breaker by Siemens. SPECIAL FEATURES: TOP MOUNTED, WITHOUT DOOR, ALUMINUM BUS BAR, ENCLOSURE NEMA TYPE 1, GREY Product Lifecycle (PLM): PM300:Active Pro SEQ40200 - Siemens Circuit Breaker Load Center Specifications: Product Description: SIEMENS LOW VOLTAGE LOAD CENTER CSA LISTED. Here’s another panelboard diagram – this panelboard allows the use of tandem breakers in four locations. A 40-circuit panel from the year 2000 is not designed to accept any tandem breakers. Match the size and voltage requirements when using Siemens breakers, as using the wrong breakers can have dangerous results. Alternatively, you can replace them with UL Classified circuit breakers specifically for your panel. What is it about tandem / twin breakers that confuse so many of us? Enjoy! From left to right we have the vertical switch with hook, horizontal switch with hook, horizontal switch without hook, vertical switch without hook. Siemens provides different types of residential circuit breakers based on our customers’ needs and the requirements of the National Electric Code®. Stone siding might be the most problematic siding that we come across as home inspectors. Hi there! With this code, manufacturers are required to list the number of max number of circuit breakers allowed and to provide a “rejection feature” to help prevent people from installing tandem breakers where they are not allowed to be installed. The use of tandem circuit breakers is a perfectly acceptable practice, as long as the panelboard is designed for tandem circuit breakers and they're installed in locations within the panelboard where they're allowed. We are almost all white men with a lot of gray hair. This is referred to as a “rejection feature”. If the bus bars of the panelboard have been damaged or altered to allow for the installation of tandem circuit breakers, the proper repair is to have the panelboard replaced. Reuben Saltzman, Structure Tech Home Inspections - Email - Minneapolis Home Inspector. Class CTL panelboards have different methods of preventing class CTL tandem circuit breakers from being used in locations where they’re not allowed. I look at the tandems already installed in the panel and they are CTLs that have been illegally modified. We have an old General Electric panel in our house, 20 breaker. Take the amperage of the panelboard, multiply by the number of poles, and divide by 10. This is an adaptation of an article I wrote for the ASHI Reporter, which was published in February of 2011. The model or part number of the electric panelboard usually will indicate whether or not the electric panelboard is designed to accept tandem breakers and how many can be used. With these features and benefits, this camera ought to put the E6 out to pasture. Previous editions of the NEC limited the maximum number of circuits in a lighting and appliance panelboard to 42. There is zero educational content in this post. Here are a few examples: I think it's easy enough to see the pattern. QO (e.g., QO2020) are circuit breakers are designed for use in the older “non-class CTL” QO load centers that were manufactured before the change in code. Siemens type QT dual circuit breakers are 1 inch wide and consist of (2) 1-pole breakers, in varying combinations of ampere ratings from 15 to 30 amp.Type QT quad circuit breakers are 2 inches wide and consist of either (1) 2-pole and (2) 1-pole, or (2) 2-pole breakers. Get free shipping on qualified Siemens Tandem Breakers or Buy Online Pick Up in Store today in the Electrical Department. I recently had an informative email exchange with a past client that highlighted the discovery of some especially nasty water damage behind the stone siding at her townhome. Tandem breakers increase the total load on the bus bars in a panelboard. The boss sent me out to HD for some square d QO tandems and I get them back to the job and they won't fit. I went back to the depot and they fit on the panels they sell there but not on our's. Sound familiar? Vertical units are stacked top to bottom whereas horizontal units have the switches side-by-side. I tried siemens they are closer but still do not stab all the way in. For use in Siemens Type 'EQ, EQL, SEQ, EQG Loadcentres. Some use a common clip while others use a larger “hook”, which only allows the breakers to be mounted into specific spots on a panel. ZERO. The 2008 National Electrical Code (NEC) got rid of the “lighting and appliance” designation and now says, “A panelboard shall be provided with physical means to prevent the installation of more overcurrent devices than that number for which the panelboard was designed, rated, and listed.”. Yes, Siemens makes what is called a 'QD' Series breaker that is UL listed and 'classified' to be used in a very specific list of Sq. Maybe if they gave these bad boys a more specific part number then it wouldn’t be so bad, right? Let’s get things straight once and for all…. If you look at a slot that was made for a single circuit breaker and, instead, you find two narrow breakers, you’ve identified a tandem breaker. The 2008 National Electrical Code (NEC) makes it a little confusing. There is no way for a home inspector to determine if the bus bars have been damaged without actually removing the circuit breakers, which is something home inspectors shouldn't be doing. You'll also hear them called duplex, slimline, twin, half-height, half-inch, double and wafer breakers, depending on local customs. If you do not know what you’re doing, please consult a professional. Tandem circuit breakers also increase the total load on the bus bars in a panelboard; this is where home inspectors need to use common sense. "Square D tandem breaker won't fit." D load centers. Maybe if they gave these bad boys a more specific part number then it wouldn't be so bad, right? It boasts the same resolution as the E6 but it's a fraction of the price at only $699. In general, QOT (e.g., QOT2020) are the new version of tandem breakers designed to be used in present class CTL QO load centers. All panelboards must adhere to UL standards and included in this requires “lighting and appliance” panelboards to be class CTL. MAIN CURRENT RATING 200A. Check under the Siemens column for compatible Eaton UL Classified breakers. What is it about tandem / twin breakers that confuse so many of us? The photo below shows a 60 amp two-pole circuit breaker at the top, then a 15 amp tandem circuit breaker (highlighted), then a 20 amp tandem circuit breaker (highlighted), then a 20 amp single-pole circuit breaker at the bottom. Here's an old formula for determining how many circuits are allowed in the Class CTL panelboard being inspected; this formula is helpful to use when inspecting older electric panels without clear labeling inside the panel. However, this rejection feature does not stop people from modifying their breakers and installing them where they’re not supposed to. This panelboard has 20 full-size spaces, so tandem circuit breakers aren’t allowed. They have a clamp on one side and a hook on the other. Now that I’ve talked about the general rules for tandem circuit breakers, I’ll discuss the ways that home inspectors or electrical inspectors can determine when tandem circuit breakers are allowed in various panelboards. You might want to double check, Super surreal: Ex-Gophers ride 'crazy' adventure with Bucs, Wild postpones games through Tuesday because of COVID-19, Minneapolis group gets a chilly thrill with daily dips in Lake Harriet, Crowlers became Minnesota breweries' untapped resource during pandemic, Four Minnesota Black elders tell their stories in a film about racism by singer J.D. Check wiring diagram to confirm. The potential dangers could be life threatening and are not worth the risk. For panelboards not manufactured as "lighting & appliance" panelboards, there is no limit to the number of circuit breakers allowed. In the photo below, you can see that only 20 circuits are allowed at the panelboard. Another easy thing to look for is a label stating the maximum number of circuits allowed. I'm not sure if this panel is allow tandem breaker. Convertible/Main Breaker, 100A, 1 Phase, 3 wire, 20 Spaces, 20 Circuits, Indoor. The difficulty for home inspectors is that the marking is not usually visible after installation, and home inspectors aren't supposed to pull out circuit breakers to try to figure this stuff out. Tandem circuit breakers are manufactured this way in an effort to prevent people from using them in an improper manner – but this doesn’t stop everyone. Panelboards with notched bus stabs allow for installation of CTL tandem breakers (QOT). Take a look around any room full of home inspectors, and you'll notice we look a lot alike. Not a good thing. 3 leader, stands by Greene, Before Floyd, 3 officers on video roughly detained wrong man, Twitter shuts down MyPillow account after Mike Lindell took it over, Twins reach agreement with closer Alex Colome, Home Inspectors don't have to be old white guys, Animals, skeletons and creepy home inspection stuff 2020, How to know when tandem circuit breakers can be used (aka - cheater breakers). Class CTL tandem circuit breakers have a different shape than standard single pole circuit breakers, to help prevent them from being installed where they don’t belong. I have a Siemens 200A panel. Siemens breakers can be used in GE breaker boxes, and they are generally known to be compatible. Circuit breakers come in several styles, including the standard single-pole breakers that serve 120-volt household circuits and double-pole breakers that take up two slots in a breaker box and serve 240-volt appliances. Manufacturers still list the maximum number of circuit breakers allowed, and must provide a rejection feature to help prevent the use of tandem circuit breakers where not allowed. Class CTL (Circuit Total Limiting) is a classification of load centers from the 1965 National Electrical Code (NEC). I thought she had such a great story to share that I invited her onto our podcast, which you can listen to below. And another – this panelboard allows tandem breakers in the bottom ten spaces only (11-20 and 31-40). :furious: You might be able to purchase a … Compare it to the image on the right and take note of the hook, this is the same QOT2020 vertical switch hook tandem breaker. All tandem breakers can be shipped to you at home. America's First Call for Commercial / Industrial Circuit Breakers & Other Electrical Parts. The vertical vs horizontal refers to the switches on the face of the breaker. This is a normal and legitimate practice as long as the panelboard is designed for tandem circuit breakers and these breakers are installed on the panelboard where they are specifically allowed. Siemens space saving, plug in circuit breakers are intended for use in Siemens EQ, Siemens Ultimate, ITE, and Gould load centers and meter combinations that are rated to accept type QT breakers. Usually if a breaker has a hook it is referred to as a “QOT” and if it does not then it would be considered a “QO Twin or Tandem”, but this is not always the case. Semi-Long Term Experiment Results: Zinc Strips Kill Moss on Roofs. Contact Relectric today for help sourcing these breakers or any other power distribution equipment. I … Tutorial for confirming whether a Homeline load center will accept HOMT Tandem circuit breakers when the catalog number is unknown. A tandem circuit breaker is a double circuit breaker that takes up the space of a single circuit breaker on a panelboard. I'm installing a bunch of new circuits as part of finishing my basement and one breaker won't fully seat. What are the shipping options for tandem breakers? Check wiring diagram to confirm. In the photo below, the highlighted bus stabs are notched to allow the use of tandem circuit breakers; the bus stabs which don’t have this notch won’t allow tandem breakers. A special kind of circuit breaker is the tandem breaker, which is designed to allow two 120-volt circuits to be fit into a single slot in the circuit breaker box. Confusion abounds over the use of tandem circuit breakers in panelboards, even among electricians and electrical inspectors. Siemens manufactures a CLASSIFIED breaker that is suitable for replacement ONLY in certain Square D panels as indicated on the breaker literature. In the photos below, you can see how someone broke the bottoms of the circuit breakers to make them fit where they didn’t belong. Is Your Water Softener Installed Correctly. The hook refers to the way the back of the breaker clips into the panel on the bottom side. A tandem circuit breaker is a double circuit breaker that takes up one circuit breaker space on a panelboard. Below is an example of a compatibility chart by Eaton. However, I've 3 tandem breaker installed from the … Are there any tandem breakers that will stab into a Square D homline panel? This stuff is failing left and right all over the country, and most of time the homeowner has no idea when their wall is a rotted mess behind the siding. Siemens plug-on breakers are very similar to the GE THQL and in most cases will physically fit however UL listing may be lost when using Siemens breakers in GE equipment. SIEMENS Q21530CT 30 Double Two 15-Amp Single Pole Circuit Breaker, As shown in the image - Thermal Magnetic Circuit Breakers - Amazon.com Circuit breakers are intended for switching and protection of your home's wiring from high temperatures caused by excess current higher than the rating of the For panelboards manufactured before adoption of the Class CTL standard, non-Class CTL tandem circuit breakers are allowed to be installed as replacement circuit breakers only. Because tandem circuit breakers allow for two circuits to be installed on a panelboard in a one circuit breaker space, they're typically used after a panelboard has been filled to capacity with standard circuit breakers. To ensure the warranty on a Siemens panel is not voided, the use of Siemens breakers is required. The cutout on the back side bottom of the breaker is not large enough. When people make modifications and alterations, they could be asking for trouble. Some may confuse tandem breakers with two-pole circuit breakers, however, tandem breakers do not get connected to two different poles at a panelboard and do not have a common trip or handle tie for simultaneous disconnecting of two poles — unlike a two-pole circuit breaker. Those breakers were probably modified/damaged in order to make them "fit" into the panel. This formula is also no longer applicable for today's panels. For this reason, they’re usually used on panelboards that has filled to capacity with standard breakers. Read on to learn how to distinguish them and what the hazards are when improperly installing them. At Breaker Outlet, we stock and sell a wide range of circuit breakers and other electrical equipment from Siemens along with many other top manufacturers. I start popping out breakers to combine them and my CTL tandems won't fit. No matter what kind of job you’re working on (commercial, residential, or industrial), Breaker Outlet has all of the parts you could ever need to get the job done right and at an affordable price. 2-pole constructions range from 15-50 amps and are available with internal Take a look at the image below to see a common modification on a QOT2020 vertical switch with hook tandem breaker. Today I'll set the record straight as to when tandem circuit breakers can be used. I'm past my return time and should have checked sooner but these would have never worked. The next photo shows an older style tandem breaker found in Square D panelboards. What is the top-selling tandem breakers product? Confusion abounds over the use of tandem circuit breakers in panelboards, even among electricians and electrical inspectors. Call us 24/7. There are a number of ways to do so. 1-PHASE MAIN BREAKER 40-CIRCUITS. Osterholm: Delay 2nd COVID-19 dose to get more vaccinated, New report urges Minn. lawmakers to adopt stronger sex assault laws, National money flowing into fight over Minneapolis Police Department, Minneapolis schools prepare elementary buildings ahead of students' return, People with disabilities push for inclusion in Minn. vaccine plan, Think you have a vaccine appointment in Duluth? It sounds complicated, but it's not — let's use a 100-amp panelboard as an example: Based on this formula, the maximum number of circuits allowed in a 100-amp 120/240-volt panelboard is 20. How does a home inspector determine whether tandem circuit breakers are allowed on the panelboard they're inspecting? Reuben Saltzman is a second-generation home inspector with a passion for his work. There is no such thing as an interchangeable circuit breaker. Tandem breakers are known by different names, such as duplex, slimline, twin, half-height, half-inch, double and wafer breakers.
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